Lesson 4
vomoi seltadni
Conversation
nu casnu
*** insert discussion of conversation
4.1
Question Words
preti valsi
*** insert discussion of Lojban questions
ma
This is the equivalent of the English pronoun questions: "What?"
"Who?" and "Which?" in many contexts. It can be used in more than one
sumti place to ask more than one question at a time; each "ma"
represents a different question to be answered.
ki'a
We have already seen that you can request repetition with the vocative
marker "ke'o". Sometimes, however, it is just a word that you aren't
sure you heard correctly, or even a word which confuses you. In this
case, you can either repeat what you heard, or just the word(s) in
question. If you are asking about a specific word, you follow that
word with "ki'a", which requests clarification. If the scope (the
length of text being questioned) is the whole sentence, or a
substantial portion thereof, then you put "ki'a" at the beginning of
the sentence. "ki'a" has a lot of uses which will become more evident
in later lessons, and we will leave it undefined for now beyond this
explanation.
mo
"mo" is the bridi question word. You probably first saw it at the top
of the Lojban brochure. It roughly translates to "What?", but this
doesn't do the word justice.
"mo" acts very much like "ma": it leaves a blank to be filled in.
"ma" requested a sumti to be filled in; "mo" requests a selbri. For
now, presume that this means a brivla. Like "ma", "mo" can be used in
more than one place in a sentence to ask more than one question,
though we cannot give any examples using the grammar presented thus
far. Each use of "mo" represents a different blank to be 'filled in'.
There are several examples of the use of "mo" in conversational
contexts at the end of this lesson. They will probably communicate
the usage of "mo" better than any English explanation can provide.
na
*** insert brief explanation of "na"
4.2
Quotations
tersitna
When learning a language, you often need to talk about things that are
said. Lojban does this with quotation. Because of Lojban's
unambiguous grammar, however, several kinds of quotations are both
necessary and useful.
ALL QUOTATIONS HAVE THE GRAMMAR OF SUMTI
This means that you can put them directly into sentences like:
la koRIN. cu cusku lu ti cu klama li'u
Coreen expresses "ti cu klama".
As is obvious in the above example,
lu left quotation mark
marks the left side of a grammatical text quote
li'u right quotation mark
marks the right side of a grammatical text quote
We specified grammatical text, because if it isn't, then the grammar
of the quotation might get confused with the grammar of the outer
sentence, which isn't permitted. In any case, it is useful to be able
to indicate with the quotations that the quoted text is or might be
invalid. Two separate quotation marks are used for ungrammatical
quotation:
lo'u left quotation mark
marks the left side of an ungrammatical text quote
le'u right quotation mark
marks the right side of an ungrammatical text quote
These correspond to the "*" that you will occasionally see marking
erroneous Lojban in this text. Incidentally, though, these quotes
presume that the text being quoted is Lojban, even if ungrammatical.
To quote non-Lojban properly requires another type of quote that we
will not present in this lesson. At the risk of introducing a bad
(and incorrect) habit, use lo'u/le'u for such quotes for now.
Having to put things in quotes can be quote stilted unquote. See what
I mean. In Lojban we have a couple of short cuts, one of which will
be taught in this lesson:
zo single word quote
marks the following word as a quoted word not to have
grammatical effect on the main sentence.
Since a lot of quotation is of single words, this can be convenient.
For example, we can rephrase the introductions from examples (1) and
(2) as normal bridi, which is possibly a more natural Lojban than the
pseudo-bridi of a "du" identification:
lu. bab. li'u cu cmene mi "'Bob' is the name of me."
or "'Bob' benames me."
zo. noras. cu cmene mi "'Nora' is the name of me."
"zo", of course, cannot be used with a two-word name. It also cannot
be used with a cmavo compound like "da'amoi" (which is composed of
da'a + moi) since you have no way of telling that the quote doesn't
end after "da'a", which is a valid Lojban word.
4.3
Oops!
.e'enai
Everyone makes mist takes, even your friendly textbook writer. (Yes,
it was intentional.) Lojban has three verbal eraser words to take
back what you said. These words are 'beyond the grammar' to some
extent - they override anything in the language except for quotation.
(You don't want to have a quoted eraser word erase the quotation
marker.) Otherwise, you can use them anywhere (between words) in
Lojban.
si single word eraser erases the last word.
This works like "zo", so to erase "zo coi" takes "zo
coi si si", or the word after the "si" would end up
being quoted.
sa sentence eraser erases to the beginning of the sentence.
In a quotation of one sentence or less, erases to the
beginning of the quotation.
su text eraser erases to the start of the discussion,
effectively dropping the subject
Next we will discuss another nice tool for talking about mistakes:
di'u the last sentence
This has the grammar of a sumti, like KOhA, but refers
to the last sentence as a entity. It can thus be used
as in:
di'u cu drani "The last sentence is correct."
This is equivalent to a different use of the words "this" and "that"
than "ti", "ta", and "tu" express, specifically the usage applicable
to the first word of this sentence. You can't point to or
'demonstrate' an already spoken sentence.
Closely related to "di'u" is:
la'edi'u /lah,heh,dee,hu/
the referent of the last sentence
This is another way we use "this" and "that" that conflicts
ambiguously in English with all of the rest, especially that which is
equivalent to di'u. The difference is shown in the following:
mi cu na jimpe di'u "I (not understand) the last sentence."
mi cu na jimpe la'edi'u "I (not understand) the idea expressed in the last
sentence."
4.4
Commands
minde jufra
As our last word, we present a word of the KOhA family. This word is
almost identical in meaning to "do". However, it turns a sentence
into an imperative, or command.
ko The imperative 2nd person 'pro-noun'
Thus:
do cu drani "You are correct in ... under conditions ... by
standard ..."
ko cu drani "You, Be correct in ... under conditions ... by
standard ..."
To express the effect of "ko" simply, replace the word with "do". The
speaker is commanding "do" to make this modified sentence true. "ko"
needn't appear in the first sumti position:
la kim. cu cisma ko
"Be such that Kim smiles at you".
You can even use "ko" in more than one sumti position in a bridi:
ko cu kurji ko "Both: You take care of yourself, and be such that you
are taken care of by yourself.
(The common form of this, invented by a student in the first Lojban
class, legitimately omits the "cu" and puts the selbri final,
departing from standard order for English speakers, giving the
alliterative:
ko ko kurji)
To close on a humorous note, you can ponder the use of Lojban question
words and imperatives in the short, if not simple, question:
ko cu mo ma
which can be translated in many ways, the most English-like being:
"Be such that: you're doing what? to whom?"
More accurately, and summarizing the nature of Lojban bridi, it is
translated as:
"What is the relationship I am commanding you to make true between you
and something else, and what is that something else?"
Lojban often loses something in the translation.
4.5
Conversational Examples
casnu mupli
The following are several sentences exemplifying simple Lojban grammar
and vocabulary. Listen to each, repeat it, and try to envision
circumstances where you might use it. Some of the examples constitute
dialogs that can be studied, memorized, or acted out. The emphasis at
this point is on becoming familiar with the sound of the language.
4.5.1
Rick And Alice
la rik. .e la .alis.
A: zo .alis. cu cmene mi
"Alice" is-the-name of me.
.i ma cu cmene do
What is-the-name of you?
R: zo .rik. cu cmene mi
"Rick" is-the-name of me.
.i mi cu cilre la lojban.
I learn Lojban.
A: ma cu ctuca
What/who teaches?
R: la djos. cu ctuca
Joe teaches.
A: ti cu cukta la lojban. .i mi cu cilre la lojban. ti
this is-a-book about Lojban. I learn about Lojban from it.
R: ta cu cukta la lojban. ma
That is-a-book about Lojban by what/whom?
A: ti cu cukta la lojban. la djos.
This is-a-book about Lojban by Joe.
R: mi cu cilre la lojban. la djos.
I learn about Lojban from Joe.
A: ko'a cu stizu .i mi cu zutse ko'a .i ko cu klama ko'a pe'u doi rik.
It is-a-chair. I sit in it. Go/come to it, please O Rik.
4.5.2
ki'a And Demonstratives
me zo ki'a .e le me zo ti
ko cu punji ti ta
Put this at/on that.
ti ki'a
This - clarify-it.
ti cu botpi .i ti cu ganlo
This is-a-bottle. This is-closed.
ta ki'a
That - clarify-it.
ta cu tanxe .i ta bunre
That is-a-box. That is-brown.
mi cu punji .i ti cu cpana ta
I put. This is-upon that.
4.5.3
Explaining Vocabulary In Lojban
nu ciksi lo valsi bau la lojban.
zo stizu cu bridi ma
"Chair" is-a-predicate meaning what?
do cu zutse ko'a .i zo stizu cu bridi ko'a
you sit on it. "Chair" is-a-predicate meaning it.
4.5.4
Commands And Quotations
minde jufra gi'e tersitna
ko cu ciksi lu ko cu sanli li'u
Explain "Stand!".
ko cu catlu mi .i mi cu sanli
Look at me. I stand.
lu mi'o cu klama ti li'u cu jufra .i ma cu sumti zo klama
"We go/come to this" is-a-sentence.
What is-an-argument in-predicate "go/come"?
zo mi'o cu sumti zo klama .i zo ti cu sumti zo klama
"We" is-an-argument of-predicate "go/come".
"This" is-an-argument of-predicate "go/come".
4.5.5
mo
me zo mo
R: ta cu mo
That is/does what?
A: ti cu pinsi .i ta cu penbi
This is-a-pencil. That is-a-pen.
R: do cu cmila mi .i ko cu sisti
You laugh at me. Stop!
A: do cu darxi mi ta .i ko cu sisti
You hit me with that. Stop!
R: ko cu danfu
Answer!
A: mi cu na jimpe .i ta cu mo ki'a
I do-not understand. That is/does [what-do-you-mean-by] what?
R: ta cu skari ma
That is-colored what?
A: ta cu zirpu
That is-purple.
4.5.6
mo and ma
me zo mo .e zo ma
do cu mo
You are/do what?
mi cu merko .i mi cu remna .i mi cu glico .i mi cu zunle do
I am-American. I am-human. I am-English-speaking.
I am-to-the-left of you.
ko cu sisti
Stop!
mi cu sisti
I stop.
do cu na mo
You aren't/don't-do what?
mi cu na zutse
I don't sit.
4.5.7
di'u and la'e di'u
me zo di'u .e lu la'e di'u li'u
mi cu crino
I am-green.
ko cu rapli di'u
Repeat that-sentence.
mi cu crino
I am-green.
mi cu na jimpe la'edi'u
I don't understand the-referent-of that-sentence.
mi cu tcidu lu mi cu crino li'u .i mi cu na crino
I read "I am-green". I am-not-green.
4.5.8
la'edi'u
me lu la'e di'u li'u
ta cu blanu
That is-blue.
la'edi'u cu na drani .i ta cu crino
The-referent-of that-sentence isn't-correct. That is green.
4.5.9
Physical Relationships
nunzvati bridi
ko cu pritu mi
Be-to-the-right-of me.
mi cu pritu do ma
I am-to-the-right-of you based-on-facing what?
ko cu pritu mi ta
Be-to-the-right-of me based-on-facing that.
mi cu pritu do ta .i mi cu zunle do ti
I am-to-the-right of you based-on that.
I am-to-the-left-of you based-on this.
.i mi cu mlana do ti .i mi cu mlana do ta
I am-to-the-side of you based-on this.
I am-to-the-side-of you based-on that.
4.5.10
Quotation
tersitna
mi'o cu tcidu ti
We read this.
ko cu catlu la stus. .i la stus. cu fanva lu mi zutse li'u la inglec. la lojban.
Look at Stu. Stu translates "I sit" to English from Lojban.
4.5.11
Ending
nunfanmo
A: mi cu cliva .i co'o doi rik.
I leave. Bye, O Rick.
R: ko cu denpa mi .i mi cu cliva
Wait for me! I leave.
Exercise 4-1
larnuntoi vopi'epamoi
At the start of this lesson, each student should be accumulating a
list of information from other students. You should be listing on a
sheet of paper the names of each of the other students that you talk
to, and opposite each name, some information (a name, a word, the name
of an object, a color) that you obtain from that student, speaking
only Lojban. The essential properties of the exercise are that:
- Each student has or creates some unique information not known to
other students;
- Each student, upon arrival at the first session of Lesson 2, is
directed to elicit the information from the other students, speaking
only Lojban;
- The students should write the Lojban information they obtain,
correlated with each student's Lojbanized name;
- The information should be simple: names, words (these may be
conveyed using quotes), objects, colors. It should be possible to
ask for the information using the vocabulary in Lessons 1-4, and
should not require more than one or two sentences involving ma, mo,
and ki'a to elicit the information.
Ideally, each student will be instructed to set about gathering this
information at the start of the class session without direction (thus
allowing them to use "coi" naturally), and should have complete
written information within about 10-15 minutes after the start of the
session. The instructors can aid students (and their own fluency) by
participating in the activity themselves, going around and asking
students for their information and writing a hopefully correct set of
answers.
If you are having trouble gathering information, here are some hints.
Use questions such as:
(for names - either a real name or a pseudonym, if that is the
information being gathered)
ma cu cmene do "What benames you?"
resulting in:
zo {name} cu cmene mi "'{name}' benames me."
It is incorrect to use forms such as:
*la djan. cu cmene mi "The one called John is the name of me."
The English translation should make the reason obvious. You want to
give the name, and not the 'name of the name'. Lewis Carroll's
Through the Looking Glass has an interesting exchange (between Alice
and the White Knight) based on the difference between these two
concepts.
If you are trying to gather information other than names, the
following may work, especially for words as opposed to ideas:
do cu cusku ma "You express what?" - A vague question but sufficient
given the known context, if the respondent is being cooperative.
or
ma cu valsi "What/Which is-a-word?" - Similarly nebulous, but
pinpoints the subject of the question.
If the response is a word, the respondent can use "zo" or "lo'u/le'u"
quotation):
zo {word} cu valsi "'{word}' is-a-word".
For more general topics of information, the following question will work:
do cu djuno ma "You know what?"
If you have a less cooperative respondent, or are trying to get
information from someone who may not know exactly what you are after,
the following is a more elaborate and specific way to request the
information:
ko'a cu skari (or whatever best describes the information sought)
.i do cu djuno ko'a .i mi cu na djuno ko'a
.i ko'a du ma (for names) or .i ko'a cu mo (for ideas expressible as brivla)
"Itx is-a-color. You know it. I not-know it. It is-identified-as
what?/It is-a-what?"
At the end of the activity period, or when it seems that a number of
students have gotten their information and are either getting restless
or (horrors!) are switching to English conversation, the instructor
should direct an end to the activity and move directly in to the next
one (without immediately reviewing this activity). This should be
done with the following:
ko cu sisti .i ko cu zutse
Cease! Sit!"
They probably won't understand at first. If not, the instructor
should repeat the command to an individual student, using doi {name},
motioning or even acting out the commands if necessary. Repeat this
with a couple of students, and eventually the class will notice, and
the instructor can repeat the original instruction. At this point,
however, there should have been no classroom discussion in English for
several minutes.
Exercise 4-2
larnuntoi vopi'eremoi
The second activity emphasizes the imperative marker ko, and should
use a fair variety of the vocabulary and structures presented in the
last lesson. The instructor will start off with a few commands to one
or more others. Then, one person will be commanded: ko cu minde la
kern. ("Command Karen!" or some other student's name.) Each student
will in turn command another student to do one or two things, which
should be responded to appropriately, and then pass the command to
that person. Eventually, all students should respond to and/or
express a command, and the last student will address the instructor.
The instructor should give several examples to inspire the class.
Some possibilities are:
doi djin. .i ko cu sanli .i ko cu zutse "Jean, stand! Sit!"
doi bil. .i ko cu cadzu ta "Bill, walk to-there!"
doi seras. i ko cu carna "Sarah, turn around!"
doi martn. .i ko cu cisma la .iLEIN. "Martin, smile at Elaine!"
doi tcarlz. .i ko cu crane la fil. "Charles, get in front of Phil!"
doi glen. .i ko cu rapli zo pelxu "Glenn, repeat the-word-'yellow'!"
doi eln,or. .i ko cu penmi mi ta "Eleanor, meet me there!"
When someone responds correctly, "do cu drani" is appropriate. If
incorrect, "do cu srera" should be expressed; then the instructor
should either repeat the command or try another student with the same
command, depending on the type of error and whether the student is
likely to figure it out with a 2nd chance.
If the class seems to understand well, the instructor should try a
couple of more complicated or subtle commands, which are best
demonstrated first with a partner:
doi lisas. .i ti cu cukta .i ko cu klama ti .i ko cu punji ti ta
"Lisa, this is-a-book. Come to-it! Put it there (a table or shelf)!"
ko doi rabrt. cu spuda di'u
"Robert, respond to that last (command)!"
(after a single command to someone else that Robert can also act upon)
doi xenris. doi. pit. .i ko cu penmi ko tu
"Henry! Pete! Meet yonder!"
After everyone has participated, and perhaps 20 minutes of activity:
"ko cu sisti" to end the activity.]
The instructor can then go over the responses to the first activity,
answering questions. Alternatively, have students compare answers
with a neighbor, dealing only with questions and uncertainties.
These two activities have hopefully shown you how much expressive
power is available in Lojban with but a very small amount of grammar.
Each of the lessons that follow will increase the options available to
you in exploiting that grammar.